Zelda Wiki:Discussion Center

Hyrule Castle
 * Archive 1
 * Archive 2
 * Archive 3
 * Archive 4
 * Archive 5
 * Archive 6
 * Archive 7
 * Archive 8
 * Archive 9
 * Archive 10
 * Archive 11
 * Archive 12
 * Archive 13
 * Archive 14
 * Archive 15
 * Archive 16

The Heart Container
 * Archive 1
 * Archive 2
 * Archive 3

Milk Bar
 * Archive 1
 * Archive 2
 * Archive 3
 * Archive 4
 * Archive 5
 * Archive 6

Native Residents of Termina = Hylian?
I do not understand why the residents of Termina are listed as the race Hylian. Can anyone native of Termina truly be considered a Hylian? Hylians are from Hyrule, but Termina is a different world (canon). Though the term might not be official, Termanian seems to be a better race than Hylian for the native residents of Termina. What do you think? Dark Mirror&#39;s Link (talk) 05:40, 31 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Hylian refers to the race, so it's entirely possible that the race exists outside of Hyrule. Hylians from Hyrule are also known as Hyruleans (but Hylians are not necessarily from Hyrule), but Terminans are not. As far as we know, Terminans are biologically identical to Hylians, so I would say they're effectively indistinguishable. It's also been shown that travel between the worlds is possible as two Hylians were shown to enter it with no apparent effort, so there is zero evidence that Terminans could not be Hylian. It would really be more of a personal distinction (like "Skyloftian").
 * In any case, Hylians are humans with pointed ears. Terminan residents have pointed ears. As there is no canon species for Terminan residents, the closest accurate species name is Hylian. I would rather not have us deal with non-canon titles; it's a sloppy ordeal altogether. 19:11, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Italian Translation Problem
Hello everyone, I'm itaLink and I registered to post some translations into Italian of The Legend of Zelda. I apologize for my bad English but, in fact, are Italian. Sometimes I find problems in saving the changes because it says that I use inappropriate words, but because they are not native speaker I do not know what words it refers. How can I do?


 * This problem should have gone away by now, as you've probably realized.


 * The wiki was probably blocking you from adding certain Italian names because they looked like English swear words. It's an unfortunate but necessary feature to fight vandalism. It only blocks accounts that are totally new, so it won't block you anymore.


 * We apologize for the inconvenience. 17:12, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

A Question
Hello. My name's PhantomHeartless5. I just got on this wiki and wanted to ask. Is it all right if I add a characteristics section to character articles showcasing Appearance, Personality, and Abilities? I thought I'd ask before making big changes. PhantomHeartless5 (talk) 18:13, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
 * That is more than welcomed! As you might have already seen, we already have those section for characters such as Ghirahim or Princess Zelda, but it'd be perfect if we could get those sections out for as many characters as possible. :) Go ahead! --Dany36 (talk) 01:32, 6 June 2014 (UTC)
 * As Dany said, there are characteristics sections for characters who play a major role in the game, but the section isn't as common on minor character articles. I say go on right ahread. XXSuperXXNintendoXx (talk) 01:41, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Changing my username
Osteoderm Jacket is a nick I reused from another website, but at this point it doesn't really feel thematically appropriate to this place and it contains a somewhat obscure technical term. I'd like to change it; I was thinking of changing it to "Ice Medallion" if that isn't already taken. How do I go about changing my username? --Osteoderm Jacket (talk) 01:45, 17 June 2014 (UTC)


 * An administrator has to do it for you. I can go ahead if you're settled on "Ice Medallion." Keep in mind that we'd rather not have to rename people several times over, so when someone picks a new name we expect them to stick with it for a good while. Just saying :P 02:09, 17 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Go ahead and change it. I'm pretty sure I want this name and not OJ at this point. Should I put up a note on my user page saying what my previous nickname was? --Osteoderm Jacket (talk) 05:16, 17 June 2014 (UTC)


 * You don't have to. I used to go by "Neo," but now I just use my name. I don't mention it on my userpage. Anyway, I'll take care of that for you if HK hasn't. Just be sure to change your sig to match your new name. 12:58, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Regarding Super Smash Bros.
I was recently going through some pages in order to update them with new information pertaining to, which eventually led me to having a look at a few of the pages relating to some of the older Super Smash Bros. games. As I was browsing, however, I couldn't help but notice that many of them were untidy, inconsistent, and outdated, and I even thought that some were completely unnecessary. The Super Smash Bros. series is non-canon, many aspects of it don't really fall under what I feel a Zelda-based wiki should cover, and I think that the way we handle information associated with it could definitely be improved. Originally, there were a few specific articles that I was going to edit, but I eventually ended up wanting to make quite a lot of major edits to many different pages, so I thought that it would be best if I listed them all here. Basically, what I want to do is this:
 * Do something with the pages for trophies and stickers. Either merge them with the game articles themselves or move them to something along the lines of "List of Trophies/Stickers in Super Smash Bros. X". That way, the trophy page won't become oversized with the release of future games.
 * On a related note, decide whether or not items, music, stages, and enemies from the Super Smash Bros. games deserve similar treatment.
 * Split all of the Zelda-related stages from the Super Smash Bros. series into their own articles. While some are virtually identical to their original appearances (e.g. Skyloft), others are completely different (e.g. Hyrule Castle), and some are somewhere in between (e.g. Great Bay). I think that treating them all the same way and giving them separate pages would allow for slightly more detailed descriptions and make pages less cluttered. They can have either "(Super Smash Bros.)" or "(Stage)" at the end of their titles to disambiguate.
 * Move Template:SSB Stages to "Template:Stage", which is a much simpler name, and add a "Game(s)" field to it. Possibly include a "Theme Music" field, too.
 * Create a category titled "Super Smash Bros. Stages" and incorporate it into the template.
 * Delete either Template:Smashwiki or Template:Exitstub-nintendo, and only use the other to link to more in-depth articles on SmashWiki. There's no real need to have two templates that serve the exact same purpose.
 * Delete the hack and glitch pages for all of the Super Smash Bros. games; they don't fall under our scope.
 * Move Hyrule: Temple to either "Temple (Super Smash Bros.)" or "Temple (Stage)". That's the most recently used and more accurate name. Leave the original page as a redirect.
 * Delete Characters in Super Smash Bros. (Series), for the same reason as the hack and glitch pages. Have a list of all Zelda-related characters on the individual pages for each game, or perhaps create a separate gallery page for each game like we do for canon titles. I personally prefer the former idea.
 * Once again, decide whether or not trophies, stickers, items, music, and enemies deserve similar treatment. I believe that the latter three should simply be listed on the individual game articles.
 * Decide whether Super Smash Bros. games (and non-canon games in general) belong in the "Game(s)" or "Other media" field of infoboxes. It's currently pretty inconsistent.
 * Merge Super Smash Bros./Link's Moves with either Link/Other Appearances, Hero of Time, or Adult Link. This ties in with the already slightly messy situation we have with the Young Link/Adult Link/Hero of Time pages.
 * Make this template a real template and place it on all relevant pages. Find a better name for it, if possible.

So yeah, that's just about everything. I'd like to hear what everybody else has to say about this. I know that it would take quite a lot of work if we were to put all of these changes into action, but I feel that there's a pretty large need for improvement. If you want me to elaborate on any of these points, feel free to ask. 14:19, 19 June 2014 (UTC)


 * I could get behind all that, with a few exceptions.


 * Some points in response:


 * I think the Trophy and Sticker articles are fine as they are, but I suppose it would be better to split lists by game. I'm against merging them with the game articles because there's too many of them. It would bloat the articles.


 * As for everything else (characters, items, music, etc.), those could all be merged as long as we keep their descriptions brief and there's not so much information that it bloats the pages. We could even scale back our coverage on stages to just small, merged summaries on the game articles. If we did that, we could just delete Template:SSB Stages. Let SmashWiki go into detail about the stages; for obvious reasons they do a better job of it anyway. (On this point you kind of contradict yourself. You mention merging the stages with the game articles but earlier on you also advocate splitting them all.)


 * If we were to keep using Template:Exitstub-nintendo, the wording would have to be changed. Many of our SSB articles are not just "short summaries."


 * I'd say non-canon games should be considered "other media." But maybe we should consider renaming those two fields entirely for the sake of clarity.


 * Why do we need to cover movesets at all? That's another thing we can leave to SmashWiki.

Basically, I wouldn't mind if all our SSB articles looked like does. There's no need to go more in-depth than that when we have SmashWiki as a partner. 15:40, 19 June 2014 (UTC)


 * The Trophies page is good as it is, for now, has I kinda agree that eventually it will become oversized, so maybe in a near future it would be a good idea to split the article per game.
 * I don't really see the point in having an article for every stage, as almost all the relevant info on them can be easily added to its main article (ex. Great Bay) and its respective SBB game article. Besides, like HK said, theres the SmashWiki to go in-depth.
 * I also agree that the SSB glitches and characters pages (and other pages alike) are unnecessary. The game's pages already link to the characters in SSBX articles in the SmashWiki, so there's no really point in having an article about characters outside the Zelda series. When I started updating the SSB articles, I tried to leave only the Zelda-related stuff, as the SmashWiki articles (which are linked at the top of each page anyway) have all the info about everything else.
 * The SSB games, as every other spin-off game, should appear in the other games section, although indeed some pages are still outdated in that matter.
 * I edited all the SSB games articles to look the same, just including the Zelda-related stuff, so I guess that other SSB-related articles would be better like that too. Chuck (talk) 04:50, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

You both raise fair points. Just to clarify, I didn't mean to list stages as something that should be merged with the game pages; that was a mistake. Seeing as there's quite a lot to talk about here, I'm going to split this into separate discussions.

Please post any new comments under the headings below. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Splitting the trophy article
The problem with the current trophy page is that while there are a few ways to deal with it, they all pose some issues. I don't feel that leaving it as it is would be wise. As I've already mentioned, it could eventually become oversized. Also, the "Collecting Trophies" section of the page really needn't exist, as it contains some information that is entirely unnecessary, and all of the useful information in it can easily be incorporated into the page's introduction.

Simply deleting the page and placing a list of trophies on the individual Super Smash Bros. game articles could be possible if we didn't include images or descriptions of each trophy, but I can already tell that many people would be against that. Splitting the page into separate pages titled "List of Trophies in X" would definitely solve the size issue, but the name implies that all trophies would be included regardless of whether or not they're related to the Zelda series.

I've come up with two solutions that I think could work: I personally prefer the second option. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Turn Trophy (Super Smash Bros.) into a disambiguation page that contains a very brief description of what a trophy is, as well as a link to the relevant page on SmashWiki. It would link to four pages: "Trophies in Super Smash Bros. Melee", "Trophies in Super Smash Bros. Brawl", "Trophies in Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS", and "Trophies in Super Smash Bros. for Wii U". If anybody feels that it's necessary, we could place "Zelda-related" at the beginning of each title for greater clarity.
 * Delete Trophy (Super Smash Bros.) altogether. Have a notice at the top of this page linking to all four trophy lists and the trophy article on SmashWiki.

Moving the sticker article
Stickers are a slightly different case to trophies. So far, they've only appeared in Brawl, and there's been nothing to suggest that they'll reappear in future games. However, having a page titled "Sticker" just seems odd, especially when the page should ideally be more about what Zelda-related stickers can be found in the game, rather than stickers themselves. The introduction could definitely be condensed, and I don't feel as if the "Sticker Effects" section is even required.

I feel that the best solution here would be to simply move the page to "Stickers in Super Smash Bros. Brawl", and make the introduction briefer. Like with trophies, "Zelda-related" could be placed at the beginning of the title for clarity. "Sticker" could be left as either a redirect or a soft redirect. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Making individual articles for each stage
Currently, with the exception of Hyrule: Temple, none of the Zelda-related stages from the Super Smash Bros, series have their own articles here. I feel that having separate pages for all of the stages would allow us to go into much greater detail, but whether or not we actually need to do that when we have SmashWiki to do it for us is something that I'm still not quite decided on. After all, it still is Zelda-related information, and having as much Zelda-related information on this wiki as possible is our goal. We don't have to go into too much detail about tournament legality, unlock criteria, and strategies, but there is quite a lot to be said about theme music, origin, and differences from canon incarnations. However, a lot of that stuff is already covered by SmashWiki anyway, so I'm just not sure.

Either way, Hyrule: Temple should remain a separate article due to not being directly based on anywhere in the Zelda series and not really being able to be merged with anything. Also, if we do decide to give stages separate articles, Template:SSB Stages should be moved to "Template:Stage" and given a "Game(s)" field. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)


 * I don't think the infobox template should be moved (unless it's to drop the extra "S" at the end – almost all of our infoboxes are singular). The current name is a more accurate description of the template's usage. Further, "Template:Stage" should be saved for an actual Zelda series infobox. We'll need it in the future should Nintendo release a Zelda with an elaborate multiplayer mode. We could even use one now for articles on the multiplayer stages in ST (Ancient Earth, Frozen Plains, Fire Arena, etc.), which Zelda Wiki currently doesn't mention at all. 19:47, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Making lists or galleries for characters, items, stages, music, and enemies
Like trophies and stickers, we could give characters, items, music, and enemies pages titled "Zelda-related X in Super Smash Bros. X". Unlike trophies and stickers, however, I don't feel that there are nearly enough of them to warrant this. There are two possible solutions that I can see here: I'd prefer it if we went with the first option. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Leave things as they are. Characters, items, stages, music, and enemies can all be listed on each game's page. If stages have separate pages, they can be linked to.
 * Have lists/galleries for the entire Super Smash Bros. series rather than each game. For example, "Zelda-related Items in the Super Smash Bros. Series"

Linking to SmashWiki
At the moment, we have two templates that are used to link to articles on SmashWiki: Template:Smashwiki and Template:Exitstub-nintendo. I don't feel that having both of these templates is necessary, as they do the exact same thing, and one of them should probably be deleted. Personally, I'd prefer to keep the former. While the latter is more colorful, it more closely resembles our maintenance notices than our 'see also' templates (compare Template:Update to Template:RelatedPage). It also doesn't look as good when placed in sections (compare Pirate Ship to Bridge of Eldin). Alternatively, we could use Exitstub at the top of pages and Smashwiki in sections, but I'm not really for this. I'd rather just keep one. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Other changes
The majority of the things in this section are changes that I believe most people will agree on without much discussion. First of all, the existing hack and glitch pages pertaining to the Super Smash Bros. games should be deleted. As I've already said, they're simply not relevant here. For the same reasons, Characters in Super Smash Bros. (Series) should also be deleted. I also believe that Super Smash Bros./Link's Moves is unnecessary and should be deleted. As HK has already said, SmashWiki can take care of detailing character's movesets, and as long as we mention all of the Zelda-related items/spells/attacks that are used in each one (which we already do), everything relevant is covered. Finally, as I mentioned earlier, Hyrule: Temple should be moved to "Temple (Super Smash Bros.)" or "Temple (Stage)", as it's a more accurate name. 18:28, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

'Non-canon Appearances' vs. 'Other Media'
This is something that came up in the above discussion and I felt needed a separate topic. Currently, many of our infobox templates are inconsistent in what they use to list non- or ambiguously-canon appearances. Template:Animal, Template:Boss, Template:Character, Template:Deity, and Template:Enemy all use "Non-canon Appearances", with some linking to our canon policy, and others not, while Template:Ability, Template:Dungeons, Template:Group, Template:Item, Template:Monarchy, Template:Object, Template:Place, and Template:Species all use "Other Media", with some having "media" capitalized and others not. Furthermore, Template:Event and Template:Song don't use anything, so it's not actually possible to list non- or ambiguously-canon appearances in them.

I've also seen non- or ambiguously-canon games such as games in the Super Smash Bros. series being placed in the "Game(s)" row of infoboxes rather than other rows (compare Horse Call to ), and this quite understandably tends to happen in infoboxes that use "Other Media" as a row. I think we can all agree that the "Game(s)" row should only be used for canon games. We should probably come up with a standard system for all infoboxes to use, so that things are more consistent and less confusing for newer editors. I personally think that the "Non-canon Appearances" style (with a link to the canon policy) works the best, as it makes it clear that the appearances aren't canon, links to a page that explains what actually falls under "non-canon", and doesn't mislead the reader/editor into thinking that it only includes media besides games. It's not as ambiguous as "Other Media", which different people can take to mean different things. We could also change "Game(s)" to "Canon Appearances", but I don't feel that's really necessary. 20:22, 20 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Yeah, the "Other Media" thing is my fault. When I was working on adding information about The Crystal Trap and The Shadow Prince, it used to be that infoboxes only had a "Game(s)" section, so I mindlessly added a "Books" section (which later became Other Media) for dumb reasons. :P I say we should just change them to "Non-canon Appearances" and have a link to the policy like you mentioned. --Dany36 (talk) 01:46, 21 June 2014 (UTC)